A decent laptop with 3:2 aspect ratio

[WarhawkCZ]

I've recently started using an older x61 which I got from eBay and I immediately fell in love with the 4:3 aspect ratio. I completely forgot how good this ratio was. This experience made me thinking about a new, obviously non-thinkpad, laptop with the newly-rediscovered 3:2 aspect ratio screen. However, every single online catalog I came across does not allow filtering of laptops by the aspect ratio. Do you know any laptops - not older than 3-4 years, which would be worth consideration?
Huawei Matebook X pro is tempting but the price is high, especially on this side of the pond and for something with the big Huawei logo. The candidate should be linux compatible and must allow some kind of docking (which is USB-C these days) for 2 external LCD screens.

Thank you for any tips.

PS: If this happens, I will sell all my functional thinkpads (x61, x60t, x220, x225, t42p and t430) as well as Aspire 8920g
btw: How many thinkpads is enough thinkpads?

[RealBlackStuff]

The Huawei Matebook E is quite affordable, although a bit limited in RAM
https://www.amazon.com/Huawei-MateBook- ... B0711XD7J8

Also have a look at Pop!_OS from System 76: https://system76.com/pop
It will probably run nicely on even an old 15.4" T61 and T500 (both 16:10)
The System 76 are nice machines, but unfortunately most, if not all, are 16:9.

[Saucey]

If you want to stay with 3:2, Lenovo's offerings is the X1 Tablet 2nd gen or the 3rd Gen which starts at $1400.
They are powered by Core M3 units, and have keyboard docks. You can get the Lenovo USB-C dock so that it can utilize ports while charging your laptop.

I would recommend Google's offerings with the Pixel 2 from 2015 or the 2017 PixelBook, the latter I own and the prior I had for about a month.
But, ChromeOS is intended for the simple person, and I never tried to power more than 1 display on them, so evil Google's offerings most likely won't suit you.

[exTPfan]

Among genuine 3:2 laptops, there are only the Matebooks, the Microsoft Surface laptop, and a few cheap knock-offs that don't look promising.

The X61 has the best screen-area to laptop-area ratio of any Thinkpad ever made:
T60/T61 (4:3) 14.1in 77%
T60/T61 (4:3) 15in 78%
X60/X61 (4:3) 82%
--------------------------------------
MS Surface Laptop (3:2) 79%
Matebook X (3:2) 83%.
Matebook X Pro (3:2) claims 91%
-----------------------------------------------
X220 (16:9) 12.5in 69%
T25 (16:9) 14in 69%
T450s (16:9) 14in 72%
X1Carbon 2018. (16:9) 14in 77%
T520 (16:9) 15.6in 73%

[TPFanatic]

If this is how you are calculating area, T500 (and other 15.4" T-series) are 14.1" by 10.0", for a diagonal of 17.3", and 15.4" is 89% of that. T60, T61, T500 are quite compact for 15.4" laptops.

Also darn T500 is the same size as the W700's screen.

And Z61t is 86%.

[Thinkpad4by3]

Also darn T500 is the same size as the W700's screen.

The W700 has the highest screen ratio of all the Thinkpads.
Screen area: Infinity.
Bezel size of machine: bigger infinity.
Infinity / bigger infinity = infinity.

Therefore, infinity > 82%.

Lol. The W700 bezels are kind of ridiculous but tell screen is monstrous. I was debating getting a W700 and a 20.1" QXGA display and making a 4:3 W700, or in reality a W2000 for 20" display. Probably would fit too.

[Saucey]

W2000?

[exTPfan]

If this is how you are calculating area,....

No, that's not how I (or anyone else) calculates area.

[pianowizard]

If you don't mind detachables, there are quite a few 3:2 detachables by Microsoft, HP, Dell, Lenovo, and probably a few others. Both the HP Pavilion x2 and Microsoft Surface 3 in my signature are 3:2 detachables, with 12.0" 1920x1280 and 10.8" 1920x1280 respectively. This mid-range resolution is just low enough that I can run Windows 10 at its native 100% scaling, giving a "real estate" that feels significantly more useful than 1920x1080 or even 1920x1200. When I want to read something on a tall screen, I detach the keyboard and hold the screen in portrait orientation like a tablet.

The last time that I bought a conventional laptop was in April 2014, specifically the HP EliteBook 8740w 17" monster. Since then I have only bought tablets, convertibles, and detachables, because they are more versatile, and because there are many more 3:2 ones to choose from.

[WarhawkCZ]

The Huawei Matebook E is quite affordable, although a bit limited in RAM
https://www.amazon.com/Huawei-MateBook- ... B0711XD7J8

Also have a look at Pop!_OS from System 76: https://system76.com/pop
It will probably run nicely on even an old 15.4" T61 and T500 (both 16:10)
The System 76 are nice machines, but unfortunately most, if not all, are 16:9.

I forgot to say, that I am not looking into detachables. I don't trust them and they have typically poor performance because of passive cooling. I don't need much computing power but definitely not less than x220/x230 which I've been using for very long time for all my work. Thanks for the tip with Pop!_OS. However, I am quite settled with MX linux. I believe that the world has already had enough ubuntu derivates so if something hits the fan with MX linux, I'll switch to bare Debian (or Mint, if I fail). Older machines are not an option either. I love my x61 but it can't drive more than one LCD screen, battery performance is rather underwhelming and XGA is... XGA (I work on SXGA+ upgrade).

If you want to stay with 3:2, Lenovo's offerings is the X1 Tablet 2nd gen or the 3rd Gen which starts at $1400.

Besides the fact that this is a detachable unit, the price is nearly same as Matebook Pro with i5 which is a completely different beast.

I would recommend Google's offerings with the Pixel 2 from 2015 or the 2017 PixelBook, the latter I own and the prior I had for about a month.
But, ChromeOS is intended for the simple person, and I never tried to power more than 1 display on them, so evil Google's offerings most likely won't suit you.

There is a one chromebook from 2015 which would exactly fit my needs. However, it is not possible to extend neither memory nor storage.

Among genuine 3:2 laptops, there are only the Matebooks, the Microsoft Surface laptop, and a few cheap knock-offs that don't look promising.

Just for sake of my curiosity, which are the cheap knock-offs?


Anyway, thank you all for your tips. It seems that MAtebook X Pro for Christmas it is... :-/

[TPFanatic]

If this is how you are calculating area,....

No, that's not how I (or anyone else) calculates area.

...

Got it!

T500 is 75%

[Summilux]

Just for sake of my curiosity, which are the cheap knock-offs?

Chuwi : http://en.chuwi.com/html/Perfect/

[Puppy]

Unfortunately they usually have very weak CPU.

[exTPfan]

Just for sake of my curiosity, which are the cheap knock-offs?

Cube Thinker m3

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Cube-Thin ... 312.0.html

[WarhawkCZ]

Unfortunately they usually have very weak CPU.

Yes, they have really terrible CPUs and most of them don't have USB-c which makes docking practically impossible.

Just for sake of my curiosity, which are the cheap knock-offs?

Chuwi : http://en.chuwi.com/html/Perfect/

Detachables again Their laptops are 16:9 again and specs are not very impressive.

It seems that Matebook x (1st gen) or Matebook x pro (2nd gen) or MS Surface Laptop are the only options. Surface laptop is silly. It does not have USB-C (MS seriously?!) and taking it apart is impossible (check iFix it). This means that you can trow this thing away when battery wears.

Matebooks don't come with international warranty. I was hoping that I could buy matebook in the U.S. because I travel there quite often, but without the warranty it does not make much sense. However, the price difference is significant -> 1499 USD vs 2117 USD (i7 version, amazon.com vs amazon.de).

[Puppy]

It seems that Matebook x (1st gen) or Matebook x pro (2nd gen) or MS Surface Laptop are the only options.

Unfortunately the MateBook X Pro is rather step back. It is bigger and more heavy tham the first gen. I skipped the 1st gen because of older (and slow) CPU generation, although the NewEgg price 650 USD was tempting.

No, we won't get serious laptop anymore. I've moved back to desktop PC.

[pianowizard]

I forgot to say, that I am not looking into detachables. I don't trust them and they have typically poor performance because of passive cooling.

What makes you think that the Huawei Matebooks don't have thermal throttling issues? Take a look at this: https://www.notebookcheck.net/Huawei-Ma ... 820.0.html

No, we won't get serious laptop anymore. I've moved back to desktop PC.

I love today's laptops, convertibles, and detachables because of their light weight, screen resolution, and styles, but in terms of performance, serviceability, and upgradability, I agree with you. That's why I too have been using desktops as my primary computers for over 9 years now.

[Puppy]

All thin laptops have them.

[Puppy]

I love today's laptops, convertibles, and detachables because of their light weight, screen resolution, and styles

Yes, they're cool toys for consuming content but if you need something serious for work, all of them fails to deliver enough power (except heavy and very expensive workstation models).

[WarhawkCZ]

Unfortunately the MateBook X Pro is rather step back. It is bigger and more heavy tham the first gen. I skipped the 1st gen because of older (and slow) CPU generation, although the NewEgg price 650 USD was tempting.

What makes you think that the Huawei Matebooks don't have thermal throttling issues? Take a look at this: https://www.notebookcheck.net/Huawei-Ma ... 820.0.html

Here you can see how difficult satisfying everybody is. Pianowizard sent a link to the previous version of Matebook x (1 gen). That one was too small, with passive cooling, which resulted in massive throttling. Huawei hopefully learned the lesson and made it bigger, with a fan and with a normal USB-A connector (many people complained about only two usb c). Now Puppy complains about the second version being the step back.

Puppy, I don't mind size - I use thinkpads And honestly, size difference is rather insignificant.
I don't do much computing heavy stuff but I will definitely not go for Core M. I rather take throttling i5/i7 than Core M.

[Worzyl]

I'm currently using my Samsung Chronos 7 series (2012, i7 Quad core/AMD Graphics), which is slower than the Huawei Matebook X Pro, which I was quite surprised about. The screen size is extremely tempting and the specs are powerful enough for my needs as an artist/animator. The thing that is concerning is the scarcity of the laptop here in the UK. If it breaks down or if a part needs to be exchanged, it could be problematic. For instance - I picked up a 13" Macbook Pro 2011 for someone (never owned a Mac myself) and the wealth of information on youtube for upgrading, repairing etc is insane. But more importantly, there also seems to be an abundance of parts for the machine that are easy to find, making it easier to just do it yourself.

[pianowizard]

I don't do much computing heavy stuff but I will definitely not go for Core M. I rather take throttling i5/i7 than Core M.

I'm currently using my Samsung Chronos 7 series (2012, i7 Quad core/AMD Graphics), which is slower than the Huawei Matebook X Pro, which I was quite surprised about. The screen size is extremely tempting and the specs are powerful enough for my needs as an artist/animator. The thing that is concerning is the scarcity of the laptop here in the UK.

Both of you should check out the Microsoft Surface Book 2. The Core i5 models are less likely to throttle, and are also lighter than the Core i7 ones. If 13.5" is too small, get the 15.0-incher, although Core i7 seems to be the only option.

[Worzyl]

Both of you should check out the Microsoft Surface Book 2. The Core i5 models are less likely to throttle, and are also lighter than the Core i7 ones. If 13.5" is too small, get the 15.0-incher, although Core i7 seems to be the only option.

Thanks!

I just looked at the Surface Book 2. They are quite a bit more expensive - but the main thing, is that it needs to be sent into be repaired if it breaks and it is even less upgrade friendly.
I travel with my laptops a lot:

T60p - struggled when I was in Greenland. Battery packed up. Fans were on their last legs which mad the laptop sound like a plane taking off, but it lasted till I got back.
Samsung - Broke down from over heating when I was in Ghana. The keyboard was shot so I had to buy an external one.

I'm sure some other breakdown will happen in the next country I travel to.

[Puppy]

Microsoft Surface Laptop 2 now in black color is another option (specs)

+ 13.5" 2256 x 1504 (201 PPI), 1500:1 contrast ratio, 100% sRGB color coverage
- very few ports
- almost impossible to service yourself
- Windows 10 Home (upgrade to Pro is added cost)

The keyboard layout is crap like all current laptops, including ThinkPads. At least Home/End/PgUp/PgDn keys are clustered, don't know whether you can map Fn + cursor keys. I'd miss trackpoint of course but the new low profile one is not that good to use anyway so I'd end up with wireless Bluetooth mouse.

Waiting for reviews.

[pianowizard]

Microsoft Surface Laptop 2 now in black color is another option

IMO this is the most appealing 3:2 laptop yet. 2.76 lb is fairly light for a 13.5-incher. For comparison, the 13.5" Surface Book 2 weighs 3.38 lb. 2256x1504 gives plenty of real estate, 7.9% more than QXGA (2048x1536). The pixel density of 201 DPI makes this screen slightly easier to view than the 213.7 DPI of my Surface 3; for me 201 DPI is definitely low enough to use Windows at 100% scaling. $999 is very reasonable for 8GB RAM, Core i5, and 128GB SSD. (Actually, I am eligible for educational pricing and would pay $899.10 instead of $999.) For use on the road, one USB port should suffice, and I'm glad it's not USB-C. Having Windows 10 Home preinstalled is much more convenient than having Windows 10S preinstalled. I don't mind being unable to service, because if this laptop were serviceable it would weigh >>3 lb and might also cost significantly more than $999. I agree that the keyboard layout is the bigest weakness, especially for people like me who use keyboard shortcuts extensively, but like you said these days most laptops have crappy layouts.

I still prefer detachables, but do find this Surface Laptop 2 tempting. If it had WWAN it would be even more tempting, and if its screen could rotate 360 degrees I would have ordered one!

[Puppy]

HP Elite x2 1013 G3 (i5-8350U, SSD, 3k) 2-in-1 Review

Just another Surface tablet clone but still worth to check. Display has low contrast but it is WWAN ready and has no annoying loud fan (unlike many current ThinkPads).

[pianowizard]

IMO this is the most appealing 3:2 laptop yet. 2.76 lb is fairly light for a 13.5-incher.

I failed to mention that, due to the 3:2 aspect, the screen area of this 13.5" Surface Laptop 2 (84.12 sq. inches) is actually a little bit greater than that of a 14.0" laptop with 16:9 aspect ratio (83.75 sq. inches). The height difference is even more pronounced: 19.02 cm for the Surface Laptop 2 versus 17.42 cm for 14.0" 16:9 laptops.

but it is WWAN ready

I haven't looked into this particular HP but in the US, many if not most laptops/detachables equipped with WWAN are locked to specific carriers. I wouldn't mind if they were locked to my carrier (T-Mobile), but the vast majority are locked to the other three carriers, and I don't know how easy it is to unlock them. Microsoft was smart enough to make a Surface 3 model with unlocked WWAN, which I bought about a year and a half ago to replace the Thinkpad 8 tablet (see viewtopic.php?f=58&t=121458). An even more ingenious move by Microsoft was allowing the Surface 3 to be charged by any micro USB charger, so when I travel I need to carry just one charger for both my phone and the Surface 3.

[Puppy]

many if not most laptops/detachables equipped with WWAN are locked to specific carriers.

Isn't it a firmware issue only? For instance the EM7345 WWAN in ThinkPad 8 tablet reads the carrier from SIM card upon boot and loads corresponding carrier-specific (if any) firmware. This is US specific issue I believe because there were separate firmware files for three US carriers and generic one for rest of the world.

[ajkula66]

Isn't it a firmware issue only? For instance the EM7345 WWAN in ThinkPad 8 tablet reads the carrier from SIM card upon boot and loads corresponding carrier-specific (if any) firmware. This is US specific issue I believe because there were separate firmware files for three US carriers and generic one for rest of the world.

US carriers use a different set of bands AND are very keen on locking the hardware...gotta love the monopoly...

On the "main" subject matter...please wake me up when 3:2 becomes a little more mainstream....I am very interested in the format but have yet to see a 3:2 laptop that I'd accept for free, let alone pay for...