Thinkpadders, do NOT Rejoice, WEEP and/or DESPAIR!

[dr_st]

The truth is Lenovo doesn't want non 16:9 ThinkPad because it would look different. ThinkPads must be generic

You know, somehow I don't think this is the truth.

I would more readily believe that it's simply the fact that acquiring any non-standard component requires a non-standard process, which causes extra headache to someone, and no one really wants that headache for someone's pet project which is not within the core business line of the company. Or even if someone wants it, then someone up their management chain does not want to ratify it.

[pianowizard]

Why should that even be a question? There is no reason at all to not do a 14" model if thats what most people chose. What makes more sense: People chose a 14" 16:10 screen. If you can´t/won´t do that for whatever reason, do you do a 12" 3:2 screen or a 14" 16:9?

If I recall correctly, there were two separate polls for screen size and aspect ratio. 14" got the most votes for screen size, but 16:9 got the fewest votes for aspect ratio. My question was, why did Lenovo listen to the former but not the latter? This is supposed to be a retro Thinkpad. 14" doesn't make it retro, but a taller-than-16:9 screen does, regardless of size.

Let me put this another way: had there been a poll asking people to choose between 14" 16:9 and 12" 3:2 or even 12" 16:10, people would have preferred 12" 3:2 (or 12" 16:10), AND YOU KNOW THAT.

[chx1975]

With a 14" 16:10 panel, a new chassis would have to be made, which raises costs immensely. I have a question for you: Would you buy a 3500 $ machine with a 14" 16:10 panel? After all, its not what you want, your preference is 15" - 17" and 4:3 or at least 3:2. You have made clear before that an X300 (which by the way was not David Hills wish, he wanted a new ThinkPad Butterfly instead of the X300) inspired model wasn´t what you want.

Who I am to question your competence but -- no. A new chassis would not be necessary. The T470 is 232.5 mm. A 16:9 panel has a bezel opening of 312.5 x 177.1 , keeping the width the same you need 196.8 for 16:10, total bezels: 35.7mm. Now, the Dell XPS 15 is 235mm in this dimension and squeezes a 349.0 * 198.4 bezel opening in there, total bezels: 36.6mm. Are you sure Lenovo can't shave off another millimeter off the bezel technology Dell uses ? And if yes, since we are talking custom panels then decrease the other dimension 1.6mm and congrats you just squeezed a 16:10 screen into the lid of the T470. The screen diagonal would still grow by 8.22mm so noone can complain it's not 14".

Ps. I did not mention the bezels of the XPS 13 because that'd be cruel

[Summilux]

Yes, you can do both, thats why Lenovo has Premium PCs these days, both on the consumer side (Lenovo Yoga 920) as well as on the business (X1 Yoga, X1 Carbon, to a lesser extend P51, P71) side. I think the Yoga 900 line is the most likely Lenovo laptop line that could implement 3:2 first.

IIRC the Yoga line is half-tablet, half-laptop, so indeed it would make sense for risk-averse Lenovo to start with that.

ThinkPads are business products. Businesses care about cost, very much. 10 $ less means a company saves 10,000 $ if it buys 1,000 laptops. So ThinkPads, as business products, have to compete on price. There is no alternative if you want to make money in selling to businesses.

The logic you describe is intuitive but in reality cost is not always an important factor. Thus the oft-repeated argument that Lenovo absolutely had to cut costs everywhere in order to survive and make profits, can be questioned.

To quote this book :

Although there are customers who care mainly about price, we have found no correlation between this price sensitivity and company size. [...] Repeatedly, we have found there is almost no relationship between volume and price sensitivity. [...] We have recently finished a major industry study and could not find any indicator of price sensitivity. You couldn't tell by industry; you couldn't tell by size; you couldn't tell by volume purchases. There are some price-sensitive big companies and some relatively price-insensitive big companies.

So it comes down to targeting the right customers and proposing them adequate products which address their priorities. Price-sensitive businesses ? Offer them mid-range Ideapads. Productivity-oriented businesses ? Offer them more expensive Thinkpads with a good keyboard and a 3:2 screen.

We can actually thank the Ultrabook trend, Smartphones, Tablets and Apple for re-invigorating the prosumer PC market

I certainly agree with that. People using phones and tablets, including as business tools, means that laptops are veering towards becoming niche products. And the more niche a product becomes, the less price sensitive it is.

But business customers don´t care. They don´t boycott 16.9, just like they don´t care if the screen has 1366x768 or 1920x1080. So why should the manufacturers take a risk with 3:2? This just means that the device becomes more expensive - which in turn costs sales, because companies will just buy the cheaper 3:2 alternative.

If companies actually cared, 4:3 would have never been discontinued. [...] This means that PC-manufacturers are in a weak position in negotiations, they need the screen manufacturers, not the other way around.

You make a good point about the businesses not complaining (much). I believe this is because computer manufacturers didn't do their job of educating and partnering with their customers.

See, if a company's core competency is to make computers, then it should know which computers are best for which applications. So if said company is faced with supplier problems (display makers wanting to phase out square screens), it should go meet its clients and tell them "16:9 isn't good for productivity. 4:3 or 3:2 is what you want. Let's make sure the display makers understand our demands".

In addition, there should have been a strong, coordination from major computer manufacturers versus the display makers. A lobby pressuring the display makers to continue making quality square screens.

Apple is a special case, because they re-invented this category of device with the iPhone. Their brand recognition is strong. They have a fanatical following who pays almost any price and they also have another advantage: User lock-in. Apple has its own operating system, which locks in users into their ecosystem and thus makes them less likely to buy a product of a competitor.

So you can´t really compare Apple with Lenovo or the Smartphone market with the PC market.

It's funny that you point this out, because, have you not realised that Lenovo had (and still do but to quite a lesser extent) exactly the same advantages ?

Why do you think there's a dedicated Thinkpad forum ? And why do you think we're still mourning the Thinkpads and moaning against Lenovo after all these years ?
That's because the Thinkpad brand used to be special. Because it's keyboard and trackpoint, whose qualities are unmatched, have locked-in a good number of people.

People who didn't care so much about the keyboard and/or trackpoint have already switched brands. - and rightly so, good on them. But there are still loyal users who are trapped with Lenovo because this brand is still the only one which is in position to potentially release the famed IBM keyboard/trackpoint.

Loyal users are willing to pay a higher price, but they demand a good product in exchange for that.

Its too different. Smartphones are not low-margin, they also are not under a stranglehold of two companies like the PC market always was (Microsoft and Intel).
[...]
ARM is an architecture open to all manufacturers, so Apple actually produces its own CPUs. They don´t have to depend on Intel or Qualcomm for that.

Smartphones are very diverse in their offering, from exceedingly affordable to extremely expensive like the latest Iphone X (1000€ ). There is a lesser stranglehold than in the PC market, but it's real nonetheless : software is dominated by Google and Apple, hardware by ARM and Qualcomm.

Sure, ARM (bought out by Softbank) and Qualcomm operate on a different business model than Intel and AMD. But that doesn't change much in the grand scheme of things : if one day they both decide to raise their licencing fees by 50%, all the phone manufacturers will have no choice but to pay up. Whether or not they manufacture the processors themselves. They will face the same struggles as PC manufacturers because they don't own the IP.

[Summilux]

I'd also like to build on some other comments by Ibthink :

Non-Standard: 12.3" panels / 3:2 Format - used by Microsoft

Then make it a standard inside your company and adopt it in your upcoming generations of both X series and tablets. Extra costs will be lowered and customers will be happy to pay a reasonable premium.

Whereas the ThinkPad 25 may be a worse compromise. But it will be much more affordable at the same time.

We're back to the half-full half-empty glass you evoked. Less compromises at a higher price, or more compromises at a lower price ? If it's too compromised, people won't even think about buying something they don't need. Whereas for something that does tick a lot of their boxes, the pill might be hard to swallow, but they'll swallow it anyway.

What makes more sense: People chose a 14" 16:10 screen. If you can´t/won´t do that for whatever reason, do you do a 12" 3:2 screen or a 14" 16:9? Lenovo still wants to sell this thing.

I ask myself why people want 16:10 over 16:9 and realise it's because they need extra vertical real estate, so I choose a 14" 3:2 screen. The premium for that could be reasonable and people would be willing to poney up the additional cost. Why ? Because it fulfills their fundamental need.

Very small volume + high development costs = high price

That's why I advocated spreading the screen costs throughout different models.

Also just redesigning a case, mobo layout (going from 16:9 to 3:2) and other insignificant changes, does have a cost but I don't believe the impact would be so extreme and financially burdening as to deter potential customers.

[Puppy]

IIRC the Yoga line is half-tablet, half-laptop, so indeed it would make sense for risk-averse Lenovo to start with that.

@ibmthink: What about X1 Tablet? Do you think it is that popular so it deserves to bother with "non-standard" 3:2 display component compared to what success 3:2 Retro ThinkPad could have been? Lenovo even forgot to provide the promised Productivity Module for it. Such risk is acceptable while they can't do what people are asking for several years over and over?

[chx1975]

We're back to the half-full half-empty glass you evoked. Less compromises at a higher price, or more compromises at a lower price ? If it's too compromised, people won't even think about buying something they don't need. Whereas for something that does tick a lot of their boxes, the pill might be hard to swallow, but they'll swallow it anyway.

Make no mistake: I will buy the Anniversary 25 as is. Yes I would have loved more than this but as things stand, I can live with this for another 5-10 years, easily as I lived with the T420 family until now (T420 until last year when I got a FHD hacked T420s). The necessary ingredients for longevity for me are just two:

• more RAM than the previous generation and 32GB will do, I have used a 20GB and then a 24GB desktop these years and had no problems, even 16GB is almost always enough, 32GB will carry me for a long, long while).
• Thunderbolt 3 for supported external graphics

A faster CPU is always welcome, Kaby Lake i7 U is some 40-50% faster than the i5 2520M. But that's just a plus. Any time I need speed I just SSH into a server. *shrugs*

There is no other choice and I am glad I am getting this one at least. The keyboard winter has been long and it won't end now, I am grateful for any little thaw. Combined with the Moto Z landscape keyboard mod (it crowdsourced less than 500 buyers!), we have a little thaw this fall, and I will stock up for I do not think there will be another thaw. It's quite awful but when you say "I won't buy this" consider there will never be another laptop (or mobile phone) with a usable keyboard. Never. Hard to swallow but it is what it is. This is our last hurrah. The curtain has already dropped, one more encore at the end of this October when a usable keyboard for a Lenovo laptop and phone both ships and this era is over. A small hope is some laptops already sporting mechanical keyboards perhaps in the far future we will see one in a ThinkPad with the TrackPoint. But the layout will be absymal still.

For a little perspective: I have started coding on the rubber keyboard of the ZX Spectrum 32 years ago. Any current laptop keyboard is lightyears ahead.

[Summilux]

Lenovo Thinkpad redesign; good is **NOT** retro!

I love this guy !

Lenovo's new keyboard & trackpoint are awful and you're never getting your old one back!

Classic Thinkpad vs. modern Lenovo Thinkpad redesign - thoughts.

[Summilux]

Make no mistake: I will buy the Anniversary 25 as is. Yes I would have loved more than this but as things stand, I can live with this [...]

There is no other choice and I am glad I am getting this one at least. The keyboard winter has been long and it won't end now, I am grateful for any little thaw. It's quite awful but when you say "I won't buy this" consider there will never be another laptop (or mobile phone) with a usable keyboard. Never. Hard to swallow but it is what it is. This is our last hurrah. The curtain has already dropped, one more encore at the end of this October when a usable keyboard for a Lenovo laptop and phone both ships and this era is over.

I respect your poetic pragmatism.

My initial stance, like you, was to get the keyboard above all - even if it meant putting with the 16:9 crap. But now it's quasi-official that the famed two year project is but a poor variant of the T470 (textbook case of "the mountain giving birth to a mouse" or for Anglos, "big build-up, fizzle finish"), I take issue with this, finding this whole comedy utterly insulting to loyal Thinkpadders, so my blood has boiled and my mood has shifted to "fokk diese scheeiiit".

Now the only "positive" by-products of this situation that I could look up to are :

• 51nb will have fresh new proper keyboards to play with.
• Lenovo might issue an external, USB classic keyboard again.
• There's a faint possibility for Dell and/or HP to also release classic variants.

[oeuvre]

I really liked the Latitude E6420/30 and Precision M4600-M4800 keyboards. Those were really good.

Even HP's HP Compaq series and early EliteBook keyboards were quality too. If this inspired Dell and HP to sell laptops with those keyboards, that'd be nice. But wishful thinking, as it would never happen. As it is, I like Elitebooks more than ThinkPads since the *40 series due to better build quality, easier maintenance, better screens and touchpads. Also offers more physical buttons.

[ajkula66]

I take issue with this, finding this whole comedy utterly insulting to loyal Thinkpadders, so my blood has boiled and my mood has shifted to "fokk diese scheeiiit".

That's pretty much where I stand as well. I'm simply allergic to having my intelligence insulted, period.

[Puppy]

That's pretty much where I stand as well. I'm simply allergic to having my intelligence insulted, period.

BTW I am tempted to try Huawei MateBook X

[Thinkpad4by3]

I take issue with this, finding this whole comedy utterly insulting to loyal Thinkpadders, so my blood has boiled and my mood has shifted to "fokk diese scheeiiit".

That's pretty much where I stand as well. I'm simply allergic to having my intelligence insulted, period.

I hate how the industry has to revolve around consumers, the dumb idiots who will just take 16:9 displays, crappy keyboards, and keep funding the darn companirses who allow these monstrocities.

[Ibthink]

@pianowizard,

There were two separate polls, but the results of the aspect-ratio question were never published, unlike the screen size. The results on the screen size question: http://blog.lenovo.com/uploads/general/ ... rvey_2.jpg

Let me put this another way: had there been a poll asking people to choose between 14" 16:9 and 12" 3:2 or even 12" 16:10, people would have preferred 12" 3:2 (or 12" 16:10), AND YOU KNOW THAT.

Thats just your opinion. I for example have no use for a 12" system and considering the results of the screen size question it seems most people prefer bigger systems. Such a 12" system would be equipped with a smaller keyboard (less width), which is absolutely useless for me. I don´t need the absolute portability.

@summilux,

IdeaPads don´t have the business focus and lack the necessary features, services and support. While Lenovo certainly could make them business-ready, this would also mean an increase in price. Also, you would end up with devices that have both features that consumers don´t care for and features that businesses don´t care for - a mish-mash that doesn´t work.

Your point about the price is true. Thats the reason why there are more expensive business focused lines such as the X1 line for Lenovo or the HP Elitebook 1020/1040 lines. There are different Enterprise customers with different wants and needs. The bulk of the sales however is dependent on price, this is where the PC companies like Lenovo or HP make their big revenue, with machines like the ThinkPad L470 or T470 or the HP Probook 640 or Elitebook 840. While the manager may get the X1 or Elitebook 1040, the normal office-employee does not get that luxury machine. And even these more expensive machines are under high-pressure of price competition, its just on a higher level.

The problem with telling customers that square screens is better for productivity is thats it not generally true. There are use cases where wider screens are better. And adding to that, the low-res 4:3 screens with XGA resolution that were standard for years (with UXGA and SXGA being much more rare) were certainly worse than the WXGA and HD screens that replaced them, because they offered even less space. Higher-resolutions made up a very small portion of the market until very recently. In the last years, FHD is very slowly replacing HD as the standard for most laptops. Plus, 16:9 has not replaced 4:3, it was 16:10, which is less compromised than 16:9. 16:9 then replaced 16:10 because it became clear that the majority customers didn´t mind the slightly wider screens.

Coordination between PC manufacturers kept 16:10 12" and 14" panels in production for one more year, but in the end, the display manufacturers have the power in this struggle.

It's funny that you point this out, because, have you not realised that Lenovo had (and still do but to quite a lesser extent) exactly the same advantages ?

I knew that you would bring that up. The problem with this argument is that it falls apart because IBM tried to do the exact same thing and it failed - which led to the sale of the PC segment to Lenovo. So why should Lenovo have continued with a strategy that failed and only produced a loss for IBM? It doesn´t make sense. Its not even like Lenovo didn´t try to do something in this direction, thats why the X300 exists. But this model was just another failure. Just like the very expensive W700-line.

The reason for this is a substantial change in the PC market that was out of IBMs control. PC prices dropped, Intel & Microsoft reaped the profits and competitors from Asia came in to offer PCs even cheaper. Operating in such a market means you have to compete on price or you die, IBM didn´t want to, because they only want to do high-margin stuff.

The irony is that IBM could have continued on like this, keep loosing money and keep making ThinkPads as an expensive hobby, because they were not dependent on the PC, it was just one of their business-segments. But of course, IBM is a profit-oriented company and so they sold it off.

Regarding Smartphones, of course Google/Qualcomm are powerful, but this market is still very open compared to PCs. Anyone can do their own version of Android without the Google stuff (which is what some manufacturers do) and there are many other CPU manufacturers than Qualcomm. Samsung and Apple, the two biggest players in the Smartphone market, have their own CPUs. This keeps CPU prices down, Qualcomm can´t easily demand rip-off prices like Intel could in the PC market for a long time.

I love this guy !

If you love this guy, you should also watch this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfO8ZHWPZ80

I don´t like some of his videos because I find his style pretty obnoxious sometimes, but I do agree with many things he says in this video.

@puppy,

@ibmthink: What about X1 Tablet? Do you think it is that popular so it deserves to bother with "non-standard" 3:2 display component compared to what success 3:2 Retro ThinkPad could have been?

I just explained to you that the X1 Tablet uses a 12" 3:2 screen that is standard, so no, its does not bother with "non-standard".

How popular that one is, I don´t know. What I certainly know is that the Microsoft Surface Pro is very popular and the X1 Tablet is the ThinkPad to cover this market.

[Puppy]

What I certainly know is that the Microsoft Surface Pro is very popular and the X1 Tablet is the ThinkPad to cover this market.

Now we can hope Lenovo will try to cover Surface Laptop as well

[Ibthink]

Now we can hope Lenovo will try to cover Surface Laptop as well

We will see. If its a big success that could certainly happen, but it doesn´t seem like that is the case so far. The Surface Laptop is a lackluster device in other regards.

Unlike the Surface Pro, its not a category-defining device. Its just another laptop. One that has a 3:2 screen, but its not unique in any other regard really (unless you want to count the alcantera palmrest).

[pianowizard]

There were two separate polls, but the results of the aspect-ratio question were never published, unlike the screen size.

The aspect ratio results were published, but later taken down. We had a discussion of the results on this forum.

Thats just your opinion. I for example have no use for a 12" system and considering the results of the screen size question it seems most people prefer bigger systems. Such a 12" system would be equipped with a smaller keyboard (less width), which is absolutely useless for me.

You must be thinking of 4:3 12-inchers like the X60. The keyboard of the X200 was the exact same size as the T400's, as stated multiple times here: http://www.notebookreview.com/notebookr ... 00-review/ . Scroll down to the third photo to see an X61 and X200 side by side. I owned an X200s briefly and its keyboard was indeed full-sized. The X200 has a footprint of 11.6" x 8.3". Its 16:10 12.1" display measures 10.26" x 6.41", whereas the 12" 1920x1280 panel in question measures 9.98" x 6.66", which is slightly narrower and so the bezel would be slightly larger, but just slightly.

Its just another laptop. One that has a 3:2 screen, but its not unique in any other regard really

The vast majority of laptops have nothing unique about them. Having a unique screen ratio already makes the Surface Laptop very unique.

[Thinkpad4by3]

I think this whole project is just turning each other against each other because we all want something slightly different. Instead of arguing over what it SHOULD be, why not see what we HAVE. Most of us bought the T420 and T430(classic swap) with no problem, why would a Retro be any different than a faster T430s FHD mod? The T430s was a great machine, so what would be wrong with the Retro(as long the keyboard is good).

[Ibthink]

The aspect ratio results were published, but later taken down. We had a discussion of the results on this forum.

They weren´t published at all. All that was said is that 16:10 had won. Thats the reason why so many people ask for exact numbers in the comments under this blog post. I think you are remembering this wrong.

You must be thinking of 4:3 12-inchers like the X60

No, I am thinking of 12" 3:2 devices like the X1 Tablet. The X1 Tablet uses a 12" 3:2 screen and that screen is less wide than the already smaller keyboard layout it uses: https://www.notebookcheck.net/fileadmin ... 87c950.jpg The bezel would need to be quite huge to fit in a full size keyboard. Which begs the question - why go with 3:2 if you have just even more unused bezel on the side as the result? Going with 3:2 "just because" seems weird to me.

If you would offer me the choice between two ThinkPads , one with a 12" 3:2 screen (and thus either huge display bezels or a smaller keyboard) and one with a 14" 16:9 screen (which can have very display small side bezels and still a full-size keyboard), I would go with the 14" 16:9 every time. Of course, even better would be 14.1" 16:10. 16:10 is my favorite screen format.

The vast majority of laptops have nothing unique about them. Having a unique screen ratio already makes the Surface Laptop very unique.

I wasn´t comparing it with the vast majority of laptops, I was comparing it with the Surface Pro specifically. Which was a very unique device when it came out and is so successful that there are many clone-devices now.

The screen of the Surface Laptop is certainly great, but that doesn´t make it a device that is as innovative as the Surface Pro. Its still the same old laptop formfactor.

[chx1975]

I think this whole project is just turning each other against each other because we all want something slightly different. Instead of arguing over what it SHOULD be, why not see what we HAVE. Most of us bought the T420 and T430(classic swap) with no problem, why would a Retro be any different than a faster T430s FHD mod? The T430s was a great machine, so what would be wrong with the Retro(as long the keyboard is good).

Exactly. The T430s i7 w/ IGP had Thunderbolt 1 and could be hacked with full HD and old keyboard both. This unhacks all that, upgrades the TB to the widely supported TB3, the RAM to 32GB and the CPU as well. This is enough for me. Support is king. In my long years in this industry if I learned anything it's this: whether a given tech fits a purpose is just a filter. Support is the decision maker. (That's why the next purchase, January-ish will be the AORUS GTX 1070 Gaming Box, both the TB3 bridge and the video card from a single vendor unless the Mantiz Portable eGPU actually happens .)

I still think we will get a panel from one the X1 Carbons for quality but that's all I am unsure of at this point.

Just gimme. And if possible, don't be horribly expensive. My smile won't be genuine if I need to pay more than 3000 CAD for this. I had 5000 CAD budgeted -- lowering my budget is the only reaction to what we get vs what was implied. I really will need to do a lot of soul searching if it's above 3000 CAD.

[ajkula66]

Exactly. The T430s i7 w/ IGP had Thunderbolt 1 and could be hacked with full HD and old keyboard both.

Which, in my mind - all the other disgusting aspects of the Retro tale aside - negates any reason to buy the fancy-logoed T470 with a proper keyboard. I'll never need 32GB of RAM, and a system that supports W7 on all levels is a plus...so a hacked T430s wins the day over Retro for my purposes.

[RealBlackStuff]

If a classic keyboard is all we get...
Let's wait till the first forum member has bought a T25, then have him/her take the keyboard and palmrest off for close inspection.
With a bit of luck the "old" T420/x220 keyboard has been reused, possibly with different connectors.
All we then would probably need is a keyboard-cable adapter and people who like the 'regular' T470 could put on a decent keyboard as well.
And 3D-print the T25 palmrest, cuz I guess they will hardly be sold separately.
If that's the case, who needs a T25?

[chx1975]

All we then would probably need is a keyboard-cable adapter and people who like the 'regular' T470 could put on a decent keyboard as well.
And 3D-print the T25 palmrest, cuz I guess they will hardly be sold separately.
If that's the case, who needs a T25?

That adapter might be challenging although perhaps the Chinese hackers could do it. And as for who needs one, someone who doesn't want to hack and also doesn't like the likely lessened structural rigidity of the resulting thing. 3D printing is great but I have my doubts.

[Ibthink]

With a bit of luck the "old" T420/x220 keyboard has been reused

No. Its a new keyboard.

[Thinkpad4by3]

With a bit of luck the "old" T420/x220 keyboard has been reused

No. Its a new keyboard.

Now if they reusued the 600X keyboard, life would be great.

[Thinkpad4by3]

Exactly. The T430s i7 w/ IGP had Thunderbolt 1 and could be hacked with full HD and old keyboard both.

Which, in my mind - all the other disgusting aspects of the Retro tale aside - negates any reason to buy the fancy-logoed T470 with a proper keyboard. I'll never need 32GB of RAM, and a system that supports W7 on all levels is a plus...so a hacked T430s wins the day over Retro for my purposes.

There is something to be said knowing that if your compiter just flat out dies, someone will come to fix if for free.

[chx1975]

There is something to be said knowing that if your compiter just flat out dies, someone will come to fix if for free.

Oh! Is that an option for Canada too?

Edit: so I see. I can order someone to come and fix it for five years even screen cracks 40 cents a day. I think I can budget 40 cents a day even if the up front payment is hefty.

[Puppy]

No. Its a new keyboard.

Why it doesn't have LED status indicators? Original render placed them into keyboard that it wouldn't require any T470 chasis modification for additional panel. Even such primitive feature wasn't implemented

[Puppy]

You must be thinking of 4:3 12-inchers like the X60.

This is actually my preferred keyboard size over the full size in X220. If they took the "standard" 3:2 display from X1 Tablet and build regular laptop with it, I am satisfied

[chx1975]

Let me put this another way: had there been a poll asking people to choose between 14" 16:9 and 12" 3:2 or even 12" 16:10, people would have preferred 12" 3:2 (or 12" 16:10), AND YOU KNOW THAT.

No way. A decade ago I used to work on a Samsung Q30 aka Dell X1 and 12" is just not enough. (You people would get an aneurysm if you'd know it had a 5:3 display )